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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
5/11/20 1:04 A

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Forgot to post my last comment on the May chat. Going there now.

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
5/8/20 6:25 P

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That all sounds so smart! I know what you mean about the weeds. I listened nearly all day long yesterday to a fasting and low carb ex-bodybuilder- so ironic since I would have to be dying to go low carb and refuse to accept that I need a lot higher muscle content, and because I want to get over being so caught up in all this. Why am I still spending so much time on it? But boy, was he knowledgeable about fasting, down to the mulitsyllabic chemicals from this or that. I found myself almost afraid to eat today because of how he said a person should break the fast. Then I thought, the hell with it, I know I am not willing to live the lifestlyle he might recommend, so why get so tied up over it? But his ideas did influence me, and I plan to alter what I had been doing. He is against a daily shortened fasting window. I'm not going to abandon it just yet. I need to get my mind ready for how I will alter things without going cattywompers. That was what happened to me before.

I'm doing pretty well. My eating plan is easy right now, and I am making progress weaning myself off being online all day and night. I didn't get over binging cold turkey, and I still have to eat. I figure it's much the same with binging on electronic devices.

I got invited to a small online Zoom cocktail party. We're asked to wear some kind of hat. Exciting!

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
0
975
1950
2925
3900
WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
5/8/20 7:14 A

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I WAS discouraged, but writing out what's in my head always helps. So I wrote a lot yesterday (cut some of it) and it was the part I didn't post wherein I made a breakthrough, which lifted the discouragement.

I'm backing off from getting too much "in the weeds" with all of the little details. I don't thrive on letting that drive me. I can overcomplicate and overconvolute my way out of a paper bag and end up walking around in circles for a long time and wonder why I'm so discouraged and can't find a way out, LOL!

Really, for me, the more simple I can keep it, the better I feel. If I get results at the scale, so be it. If I don't, I'm going to have to give myself props for making healthy choices and let the rest go.

Losing weight with PCOS really is like climbing Everest. There is no easy answer or magic formula. I just need to focus on doing my best and letting go of the results.

How are you doing today?

WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


 Pounds lost: 11.4 
0
32.5
65
97.5
130
OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
5/8/20 1:23 A

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You say you are in a very very good place? I thought you were feeling discouraged.

I have to admit, I can imagine feeling discouraged. I actually don't believe everyone is supposed to be thin, or if they could be, what it could take might be asking too much, given different bodies and all the things that can affect whether the body holds its fat or not, but it doesn't make it easier to face the reality. On one Facebook fasting group, I'm astounded by how lucky some of the people are, but they don't see it that way, it doesn't seem to me. Some people post pictures showing really big changes in their size after just a few months, while others have been at it much longer and have hardly lost a thing.

I've let my diet get restricted because of wanting to be preventative about health problems, especially mental decline, but it does make me feel I have to be a kind of outsider, which I vowed I wouldn't be. And it goes against completely opposite restrictions that are popular in the fasting community. But as I've aged and learned, I've decided I can't justify being as liberal as I once I was. I agree that eating out is not near the fun it used to be. I might change my mind at some point and just say I'll take my chances. Being more limiting has led to losing a few more pounds without targeting calorie reduction, even though that wasn't the main reason. But I admit it's convenient to fit the image more. And the calorie reduction has happened by default.

I have to say that I was tracking food for two months because I was trying to keep my protein to a limit because of being influenced by a longevity researcher who found that protein was associated with cancer especially. He said senior citizens need slightly higher than younger people, but the upper limit for younger people was .36 grams per pound, so I aimed at slightly above that. At my present weight, and limiting bread and sugar, I actually had a hard time not getting too much protein just with beans, nuts, veggies, and grains. I had to be really careful on seafood days. I had to to a lot of juggling of foods. I was also trying to aim at protein being under 13% of calories. With that, it limited my calories and I did lose weight, which I was a little surprised at. I now guesstimate, but I think I'm getting my quota of protein.

Of course, if I weighed more, it might have been harder to get enough. (But bodybuilders would think I was starving myself.) And I am not saying that I might not get more fat burning eating more animal foods. It's just not worth it to me.

I hope if new people drop in, they don't get turned off by all the nutrient talk, since so many fasting influences say not to be so concerned with it, but it's mostly us and I'm glad to be able to talk about it. I run other teams where I am glad we don't focus on all that; I like having the option.

I cautiously ask if you have ever consulted with a knowledgeable expert that might guide you through some longer fasts periodically. It is amazing some of the changes that happen even besides weight plateaus that people sometimes break through with them, though I may not be telling you anything new. I've been doing a fast-mimicking diet several times a year that the developer claims has many of the same effects as a 5-day water fast. It's used in clinical settings with cancer patients and others. Actually, I'm cheating because he advises against trying to cobble your own version of it, but that's what I do. I can't prove it's made the changes that are claimed, and I've never sustained the bit of weight I lose doing it, but I don't expect to, since I've never gone into it truly overweight. I can't even say it's recalibrated my eating, but I"m doing it anyway on blind faith. In test trials, it was found that patients with some serious problems who did it once a month for three months sustained some anti-aging markers even though they didn't change their eating in between. He doesn't recommend it for people over 65 or 70. I'm pushing it at 66, but my plan is to keep doing it at the turn of the seasons for a few more years.

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
5/7/20 4:44 P

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I haven't even started to read your posts, but you never have to apologize for multiple posts!

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
0
975
1950
2925
3900
WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
5/7/20 11:41 A

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Sorry for all my posts today. I've been thinking. I wrote that the only time I ever lost any significant weight "was when I nearly starved by eating 600 calories a day, no dairy very low carbs, no wheat, no no no..."

This isn't true.

(cut cut cut)

Oh man, that was just way too long.... besides, I've written enough here already today.

I'm just in a very very good place now. Maybe I can share more tomorrow.

Edited by: WINNINGOURWEIGH at: 5/7/2020 (11:43)
WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


 Pounds lost: 11.4 
0
32.5
65
97.5
130
WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
5/7/20 8:55 A

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I do not confine myself strictly to Mediterranean. I don't care for much fish. I do enjoy a lot of Israeli (especially Mizrachic and Sephardic foods-- hummus, couscous, falafel, olives, olive oil), and I love Chinese BUT only steamed veg and chicken, not the unhealthy stuff that most people think of when they eat (Americanized) Chinese food. I love Mexican as well, but stick to nonfat refried beans, low carb high fiber tortillas, black beans, and veggies, not tons of cheese or tortilla chips. And I eat a lot of salads and am careful with the dressing.

My kosher guidelines influence my eating a lot, but I'm not Ashkenazi kosher (the kinds of "Jewish foods" most people in the US equate with Jewish customs and cuisine). I don't mix beef with cheese, and in fact avoid most beef and most cheese completely. I never eat any pork at all. I also avoid white rice, flours that aren't whole grain and higher fiber, and too many grains. I do enjoy a good, totally plain and naked baked potato from time to time, but otherwise don't eat many potatoes. I avoid fried food of all kinds. I eat almost no snacky things like chips or pretzels.

I do like veg pizza, but I'm very careful with it, and eat almost no standard Italian fare. When I make spaghetti, I only use Barilla Protein Plus pasta, ground turkey, and a good marinara sauce. That's almost the only Italian fare I ever eat due to the issues with regular pasta (too carby) and kosher guidelines.

I eat very little dairy other than the splash of half and half in my morning coffee, and ice cream which I love a little too much. I have to be careful with yogurt, even the organic Greek. I've found that I can tolerate about 2 ounces a day before it starts causing too many problems. I also have problems digesting eggs, although egg whites haven't been causing me issues.

I have been vegetarian several times in the past and even vegan once but became very ill very quickly. Vegetarian overall doesn't work well for me because I cannot eat soy at all, and I can't eat enough beans and lentils to get enough protein. I do eat a lot of beans and lentils even when I'm not eating vegetarian. I like beans and lentils a lot.

I love bread, but avoid the white bread crap, and only go for sprouted and/or lots of fiber whole grain kinds of bread.

Long ago I gave up the standard American diet. I don't eat casseroles or things made with cream of whatever soup. There's only one canned soup I like: Country Vegetable by Healthy Choice, I think it is. Otherwise, I make all my own healthy and very veggie broth based soups. I like my own chili with lots of beans and lentils and ground turkey and crushed tomatoes.

I eat lots of salads especially in warmer weather. I love a good turkey sandwich for lunch, or an egg white with a sprinkle of cheese sandwich. In cold weather I stick to my homemade soups and chili. I also eat lots of cooked veggies; raw veggies are too hard to digest now, even with digestive supplements.

I don't bake. There are almost never baked goods in the house. I don't even like donuts except for two specific kinds, which I almost never eat. I don't like pie either, and the only cake that is tempting is a very moist chocolate layer cake. I hate cupcakes and muffins. Too dry. For candy, I stick to some good dark chocolate most of the time.

I can only have one fresh, whole fruit per day. I am one of the "lucky" rare people who are fruit sensitive to the point that it makes my triglyceride levels skyrocket if I eat too much fruit. So I eat a fresh apple or orange or a bit of grapefruit once a day. Rarely, a banana.

I know a lot about nutrition and healthful choices. Where I err most often is in eating too much, or getting a little too happy with the ice cream or dark chocolate or really good bread.

Eating out or ordering in is a full on nightmare for me. Between the kosher guidelines and the healthful eating guidelines, there are so few choices left, if any, and I get really tired of salads.

Honestly, it makes no sense why I am the size I am. I do not eat fast foods, fried foods, unhealthy foods, other than very very very rarely. I rarely eat baked goods or desserts or candy. I don't eat the white stuff--white bread, white rice... I look for high fiber high nutrition. It just makes no sense.... other than when taken in context with the PCOS and metabolic syndrome which I've had since my teens.

The only time I've ever lost a significant amount of weight was when I nearly starved by eating 600 calories a day, no dairy very low carbs, no wheat, no no no.... I did lose weight, but I could not maintain that way of eating.

I'm only sharing all this because you've asked a few times about what I eat.... does this answer?



Edited by: WINNINGOURWEIGH at: 5/7/2020 (09:06)
WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


 Pounds lost: 11.4 
0
32.5
65
97.5
130
WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
5/7/20 8:21 A

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I have lots of problems sleeping well through the night when I fast from 6:30pm until 11:30 am the next day.

Snacking/grazing is very dangerous for me, both in terms of overeating and in terms of being very very bad for insulin resistance. So I don't do it. If I do, I gain weight like nobody's business even if the total calories are good. Every time a person eats, even a snack, we trigger the release of insulin, and insulin resistance means I already have very high levels of insulin circulating through my system, which is always signaling to store fat. IF and not snacking are the only two effective weapons I can use to control the insulin levels.

What influences what I eat? I'm not sure I understand. I eat as healthful as I can. I am not able to do keto or low carb, but I also don't go whacko with the carbs and too much fat makes me ill as I can't digest it. Low carb does all manner of bad things to my muscles and joints and such. So, when I do eat, I strive for moderation and balance, an adequate amount of protein and healthy carbs, and low-ish on fat but not too low.

Edited by: WINNINGOURWEIGH at: 5/7/2020 (08:57)
WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


 Pounds lost: 11.4 
0
32.5
65
97.5
130
OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
5/6/20 7:32 P

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I felt a twinkle of real hunger before bed last night, but nothing too roaring and I really didn't want to break my fast. I did feel hungry this morning (when I tried IF a couple of years ago and had a long overnight fast, I was surprised that I often awoke with no hunger at all. Ironcially, I was eating a much worse diet then. I got re-seduced to what I call particle foods. I finally gave it up and it took until January of this year, minus about three months last spring, to get over it. Now those foods seem more like the ruby slippers to the Wicked Witch of the West than anything really attractive, though I like the sparkle!) Did not eat because of a few things until 11. Not going to lie, I felt so hungry by then that I could barely figure out what I would like. I can get too caught up in that so I just went with trying for some variety with tofu I had defrosted instead of beans, then the usual suspects. I feel so full still even though I will have to eat in about 45 minutes if I want to close my window at 6. I will not skip dinner again so soon.

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
0
975
1950
2925
3900
OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
5/6/20 1:02 A

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I had some things happen that greatly reduced my eating window today. I've been forcing myself to stay off devices (except for exercise videos or the like) until I open my window at 10 and to stay on my feet or be exercising. I tested a microwave I had to give away and found a few more decluttered things that I had to clean up some to put out on the corner. Then got involved in a phone conversation so I didn't get to a yoga series I'm supposed to do on an empty stomach until later. Ate a meal at noon. I forgot that I had webinars from 4 until 7. I usually close my window at 6. I fretted a little bit over this, but was so un-hungry before the webinars that I decided to have nothing and gauge my condition later. Still not hungry at all at 7. I was nervous about skipping dinner, but it has worked out. It's much better if I just wait until something like this comes on than forcing myself to do it, or so it seems. I went to watch the sunset and pick up some floral wire a neighbor had set out for me, and it just got too late, it felt like, to eat.

When I was in my late 20's, I did an "eating" course that was basically Intuitive Eating- wait until you're hungry, eat what you want, etc. I could never master it, and one of the issues was that I couldn't make myself wait long enough to get hungry because even then, I could sometimes go a long time without legitimate hunger. Not having some idea of when I might eat again, the sporadic-ness of it, was untenable. (To be honest, I doubt I would have been able to fast as I have been then.) Having the eating window, even if I end up shortening it or often eating during it when I'm not hungry, calms me. I am cautiously trying to just wait sometimes- though I actually wasn't even starved at noon. And I'm not willing to "eat what I want." No, I don't trust my body because I feel it's been too perverted by the food supply. Besides, we are likely to go for what is familiar, and those foods are NOT the foods shown to lead to long healthspan. I'm not convinced people who practice IE, even if they end up getting slim, are going to be in terrific health in old age because I just don't believe they would end up eating the kind of diet long-lived people eat when left to their own devices. But don't tell them that...

Are you using Mediterranean principles in your meal planning? I don't stick to any one cuisine, and I eat a lot of things I never saw on a plate when I was growing up.

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
0
975
1950
2925
3900
OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
5/5/20 5:54 P

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So great to hear from you, even if you're feeling frustrated.

I see so much misery around the scale that I can't believe that research shows not only that people who weigh often weigh less but that there is no statistical evidence of poor attitude towards oneself around it. It very much detracted from the quality of my life when it was the center. It just seems so bound up with a false sense of our identity, one that our culture promotes, and which we can cling to as the arbiter of all that is good. I sometimes feel I should spend a lot less time on Spark because of all the attention it gets.

But it does mean I have to be even more honest with myself about what I really need on my plate. I don't feel I can go by straight hunger and satiety, unless I was willing to eat at any hour of the day, and I'm not.

I have two online events today back to back that will take me through my dinner hour. I am torn because I am liking being done with eating by 6, but can't eat during the second event. Should I wait until 7 which means not finishing until even later, or have a snack before I start the first one at 4 and just go longer overnight. I don't mind being hungry during the day, but I really don't like trying to fall asleep when I'm hungry, and I do sometimes feel twinges of hunger at night since I started 16:8/TMAD, even though I'm NOT hungry after dinner. I usually feel very full.

Even though I don't count calories, I do have some guidelines about how much dense food I eat at my meals each day, so it has a similar effect to counting. That doesn't feel unnatural or deprivational to me.

May I ask what influences what you eat when you do eat? Do you tend to graze or snack a lot, or concentrate your food at meals?



Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
0
975
1950
2925
3900
WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
5/5/20 9:35 A

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I have decided not to weigh myself almost daily. I get too hung up on the scale. And normal shifts happen from day to day. I'm thinking once or twice a week is sufficient.

So far, I am sticking with IF for 16 to 18 hours a day.

I won't go on Facebook at all. For years I've been trying to tell people about the zombie cookies they install on any device that even clicks through any FB link a single time, without permission or even acknowledgement that they are doing this. And it is called a zombie cookiie because it cannot be deleted from a device; it self-regenerates in perpetuity. The only way to remove it from an infected device is to wipe the hard drive clean and start over.

Because I consider this an egregious unethical breach of conduct, I will not ever use FB.

People wonder why they receive marketing emails about the very thing they mentioned to someone else in email, and it's all from the FB zombie cookie which tracks every movement, every keystroke, and gathers all that information and sells it to anyone who will pay for it.

When I do try to share this information, usually people shrug and say, I don't mind. I have nothing to hide and no big reason to fear being tracked. Besides, FB is so easy and convenient."

I get it, but I just can't support a company that is that sneaky, who hides the truth. If it's all so innocent and on the up and up, why don't they get people's permission before installing the cookie or be honest about what they are doing? It's called informed consent and it's the ethical thing to do. Most people would grant permission. So why the subterfuge? Why exploit a hidden backdoor to install the cookie the way a hacker would? Because it's unethical.

But, that's my soapbox, and I've given up having people understand it. And my world gets a little smaller as more and more people move groups and discussion over to FB.

I, too, eat as whole foods and organic as I possibly can, with a minor bobble here and there. I don't eat junk, or fried foods, or frankenfoods (too many mystery ingredients and chemicals), and I rarely eat anything from a box or packaged. Right now, fresh produce is getting more and more difficult to come by, and what is available is priced ridiculously high. Bell peppers here are more than $2 each. Lettuce is hard to get. We do have frozen veg.

I'm doing better with the stress. That always helps with eating issues.

Anyway, hope you have a good day!


WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


 Pounds lost: 11.4 
0
32.5
65
97.5
130
OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
5/4/20 8:12 P

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Sorry to hear of your discouragement, but glad to hear you are also accessing some good feelings.

Actually I hate to tell you but it is entirely possible to gain weight on the calories you wrote about. I know of a short older (now in her 70's) woman who was morbidly obese, had the surgery, lost. started gaining again, and now has religiously tracked calories for years. She became quite thin, and finds she usually has to eat 1,000 a day or FEWER- sometimes a few weeks of 500 a day- to keep her weight where she wants. She is one of the mostly disciplined dieters I have ever had contact with, all online. I wouldn't have done it, but she wanted a slim body. I haven't been in touch with her for awhile.

How long had you done the 800 calories a day? I looked up the plan and just saw what looked like the basics, but I thought it said it wasn't recommended to do it daily past two weeks. But it does seem it could be used a few times a week for a long time. I have to tell you that I have some fasting days where I don't eat a lot more than that anyway. But I do eat mostly unrefined foods.

I haven't tracked consistently for years but I have determined approximately what a good meal is for me. Have you found any meal patterns that you know are about the "right" calories so that you could just use them as your guide?

Even if you don't lose much, there are still good reasons to fast some and eat a "healthy" diet. I hope you'll hang in there on those goals.

I'm so sorry you so often have to deal with pain along with everything else. Big hugs!

And I'm sure grateful to see you here. Save me from Facebook!

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
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1950
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WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
5/4/20 10:29 A

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Since I've been struggling a lot recently, it's time to post my good news.

I was able to really let go of a lot of stress and anxiety yesterday, and it felt so good. I had a super lovely day, even though it had started out poorly and had a couple other challenging things. I was able to just go with the flow, and it felt really really good!

I didn't concern myself with what I ate yesterday. I needed a mental break from it. This morning the scale is down a bit. Go figure. LOL But I'll take it!

What I like most, though, is being in such a good, happy place. It's not permanent, for sure, but it does feel really good.

I have not yet decided if I am going to continue IF or Fast 800. So far, I have not eaten yet, just had my coffee which is my usual for IF/Fast 800. But I am not going to push it. It might not be best for me now. I don't know, so I will just wait and see how this morning goes.

WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


 Pounds lost: 11.4 
0
32.5
65
97.5
130
WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
5/3/20 9:26 A

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Even though I have been IF off and on for years, and it's worked for me in the past, I'm rethinking if this is really working for me now. I know what the studies and science says, but as I age, my body just does not respond well to things that previously worked.

It's not just about losing weight, but when I am now gaining weight rapidly even though I am following the guidelines, it's beyond discouraging.

Frankly, I am so tired of tracking every little thing I eat (for decades now). I eat more healthfully than any of the people I hang out with, and yet, right now, I just can't lose. I have a loss, it hits a certain number on the scale, and then bounces back up, despite remaining on the plan with only an occasionally little blip. And by little blip, I mean maybe I eat 1200 calories or 1400 calories, or once or twice 1600, none of which should be enough to make me gain weight. Stall a loss, yes, but regain?

I know PCOS makes everything so much harder and so much worse. Every study I read is completely contradicted by the next study I read. Bottom line, no one has THE answer which works for every single one of us. And, everything shifts as we age. As well, chronic health conditions can so mess up things that there comes a day when it's time to wave the white flag.

I don't know what to do. It's not like I'm sitting around eating bonbons. And maybe right now has enough of its own stress that I should focus on managing the gain rather than trying to lose. All I know is that the harder I try to lose, the more I gain.

Discouraged doesn't even begin to cover it.



WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


 Pounds lost: 11.4 
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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
5/1/20 7:12 P

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Things worked out this morning so that it was pretty easy to wait until 1 p.m. to eat. But then I changed my routine in such a way that I was defending snacking, which I had decided in May not to allow, especially since I had so little time to dinner. I'm pretty sure I ate as much as I would have had for dinner, but I don't want to close my window now, as I have not been falling asleep before midnight and have been feeling some twinges of hunger later, which I have not felt often after dinner for years, even when I was up late. It feels like it would be too long a time until my body will sleep. So I will have some little nosh near 6, even though I probably won't be hungry. My plan for May had been to continue with a window from 10 am-6 pm, with some later starts when it was easy. The new wrinkle was that I wanted to stop snacking between the two meals, except for a latte or mocha. I'll try again tomorrow. I think the amount of food I take in will be fine, but I am also trying to train a habit of longer gaps between meals. I never want to go back to permasnacking.

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
4/29/20 5:16 P

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How long have you been at it, the 800 calorie option? Could you allow yourself an option of easing into it by EOD-ing it for a couple of weeks? Does flagging mean you are having some hard hours waiting for your next meal or eating more or something else that you did not intend?



Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
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WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
4/29/20 4:36 P

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It's nice to come back and find posts. Yesterday was stressful and I just couldn't manage much. Today, I am focusing on de-stressing.

I reached out to the new Spark person in Spark Mail. It would be nice to have a Spark Friend also following something similar to Fast 800. I'm flagging a bit and could use a buddy, beyond our conversation here.

Thanks for yor presence and support!

WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


 Pounds lost: 11.4 
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4/27/20 11:59 P

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Here is a link to a new Spark member whom I invited to the team, but I think will try on his/her own. But you might want to take a look. Member reported that s/he would be eating 800 calories and fasting for 18 hours. Did not say whether there was a book involved, just responding to a buddy's challenge.

www.sparkpeople.com/mypage.asp?id=JS
FJ
EDI


Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
4/27/20 8:02 P

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I fight the mental chain to the scale. It actually hardly affected me when I was losing, even though I weighed every day and averaged once a week. I had months and months of plateaus, but I knew I wasn't going to do much different, so I accepted it. I almost never am willing to change my behavior because of the scale; maybe for half a day, but not much longer. (But I also had no real health issues.) I just could not accept that I was going to compulsively eat junk food, mostly sweets, for my last decades of life after 40 years of struggle and mostly gain. I didn't care if I never lost.

But I have to admit I like catching a look at my thinner body. Just conditioning. It's a myth that it makes us better. We just get more approval. That bothers me, but others don't even question it.

I do, however, think, ironically, that eating less IS good for our bodies. The weight loss is just a side effect!

I weigh at the turn of the seasons, seven days and then average. But I watch my eating behavior every day. I rarely need the scale to tell me I've been overeating! SOME overeating is natural, I believe.

I have a lot of food thoughts even when I'm not actually hungry. It's discouraging because a doctor in a video I watched today said that was a sign I am not in ketosis. But what it would take to get there sounds too hard. I am just going to stick with a minimum 16-hour fast daily for now and try to get better at diverting myself in between meals.

Edited by: OOLALA53 at: 4/27/2020 (20:23)
Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
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WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
4/27/20 12:28 P

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You are not repeating, and it's okay even if you do.

I can TOTALLY relate to your paragraph: "I have recognized that there is an element of luck that people do not want to admit, especially in finding something they find easy or having the weight "just fall off." I see people on a FB fasting site that have absolutely astounding results in a short time and others that do just about the same thing and have hardly any change. Some of the successes started way bigger than I was and end up smaller than I am in a much shorter time and apparently stay that way. I often have to do some mental gymnastics to stay grounded since our culture worships thinness so much."

Today I am feeling MUCH better. It usually takes 2 to 3 days of being back on plan after going afar before it all kicks in again.

I think what bothers me just a bit is that I only feel happy when I see scale success, however small it might be or that it is re-losing what I lost just 2 weeks ago and then re-gained. I wish I could stop that monster in my head, but it was beat into me at a very very young age, so for now I just have to live with it and do my best every day to eat for my health.

Another big difference for me today is that I had gone off all NSAIDS since they are bad for immunity, and it was advised by physicians everywhere. But, I live with chronic, daily, severe pain, and there was no Tylenol to be found anywhere as the word spread that it didn't dampen immunity as much, so I had nothing. And the pain just kept skyrocketing. And it was that as much as anything which pulls me off my eating plan. Pain really does a number on my emotions.

Anyway, I decided I really needed to go back on my bedtime Aleve. The first morning after I would feel such a huge difference! Then this morning, as that 12-hour dose was wearing off and I could feel the pain and immobility coming back, I thought, Why don't I try taking a daytime dose? Why do I struggle through the pain in the day so much? so I am trying that today, and as much as I hate that it impacts my immunity, I also enjoy the pain coming down to a manageable level, because it means I can stay on my eating plan and move just a bit more.

It's a real Catch-22, but, for now, I'm choosing to stay on the Aleve. Perhaps with a bit more weight loss, plus weather that is less pain-triggering, I can taper off.

In any case, i am fully back on plan for a few days now, feeling better, and the scale is heading back down. Yay!

When I have less pain and stay on my eating plan, I really don't struggle as much with hunger except around 8:30pm. But my cut off is 6:30pm, so I won't let myself eat. I know that eating at bedtime is when I gain a lot. My sleep is usually better, so again it's a trade off.... better sleep or not gaining weight?

Ah well, one day at a time, right?

Thanks for continuing our conversation! It helps!

Edited by: WINNINGOURWEIGH at: 4/27/2020 (12:28)
WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


 Pounds lost: 11.4 
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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
4/26/20 12:01 P

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Hope I am not repeating myself: Back before my turnaround, when I was binging/compulsive eating just about all afternoon and/or night, I was not hungry in the mornings but still ate some kind of breakfast and liked it. When I started sticking to three one-plate meals, I was wonderfully hungry for early morning breakfast. It had been be early because for years and had to start teaching high school at 7 or 7:30, which mean getting to campus at 6:30 a.m. the was hungry for all my meals even as I lost back to high school weight (over a few years). After another few years, hunger started to recede and I have been trying to find as easy a rhythm as I had while also aiming for anti-aging benefits. (Just eating tinier meals was not satisfying.) I have ended up losing more weight, welcomed but not actually intended. I really feel for you! In my ten years of actually being way too involved here and on another site, I have recognized that there is an element of luck that people do not want to admit, especially in finding something they find easy or having the weight “just fall off.” I see people on a FB fasting site that have absolutely astounding results in a short time and others that do just about the same thing and have hardly any change. Some of the successes started way bigger than I was and end up smaller than I am in a much shorter time and apparently stay that way. I often have to do some mental gymnastics to stay grounded since our culture worships thinness so much.

I wish I could make it all easy for you! Bodies can be so different. But one thing I have become convinced of is that there are benefits to at least intermittent caloric reduction even without weight loss. And I feel better when I do not overeat. Do you? I hope at least some non- scale benefit can sustain you for a bit. You deserve to feel good!

Not super hungry but not much excited about trying to wait longer to eat because of it. Oh, if only something besides writing here or browsing the internet was as compelling as food!

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


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WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
4/26/20 10:30 A

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So much of what you write here I completely relate to!

I'm not a breakfast person, and I'm not often hungry in the morning, but sometimes I am, and sometimes I just want to eat a breakfast because the food we hve on hand is appealing.

Honestly, my hungry and not hungry function doesn't work more often than it does work. And then my insulin resistance issues don't help.

This IF is supposed to "fix" insulin resistance, but it sure is taking its time.

I also get discouraged because I can gain 5lbs in one day of bad eating. Everyone says, "Oh, it's just water weight and will come right off." Not on this body! It takes at least a week or longer of eating very little to get it back off. It makes no sense. But, I'm beginning to think nothing makes sense when it comes to my particular body.

I tried the keto and low carb recently, and all the research talks about how great it is for people, but it just makes me so sick. And that's well beyond the adjustment period.

Even this IF, with not eating for 16 to 18 hours, really messes up my sleep and sometimes it seems like it makes my arthritis issues worse as well.

I guess I'm a bit discouraged today. But I'm not giving up yet.

WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


 Pounds lost: 11.4 
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32.5
65
97.5
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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
4/25/20 2:30 P

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I woke up hungry in a way I don't usually. It was really a struggle to get to my eating window. I definitely ate beyond fullness yesterday. I felt driven. Not in the old compulsive way, but definitely propelled. It finally settled down and the rest of the window was pretty peaceful.

Not very hungry this morning, and not the same push to eat, but I did go ahead and start brunch (in my window) before hunger. (Still working on eating.) I think it will help to think about a specific meal I will have later so even if random thoughts to nibble come up, I will think about how I like to save my appetite for a meal. I enjoy it more that way. I continue to envy people who have a window that feels like it really fits, but the discomfort I have is actually minor. I don't think there is a better option out there right now.

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


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4/24/20 12:13 P

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Yesterday I again had had no hunger but finally ate at 3 p.m. .Ketones? Who knows. I am pretty sure I ate around 800 calories or less. I don't intend that but would have had t stuff myself to get it all in my window. I read on other sites of women eating in a 2-3 hour, or even less, window and still chowing down on 1200, 1300, even 1600 calories. Then they wonder why they aren't losing. (It is on a site that keeps saying not to worry about calories.) But they say you are supposed to stop eating when just you're full. If I'm not careful, when I do that, I get really hungry in a few hours.

I had been doing things to stay busy but after the morning, a struggle happened that has been an issue for decades. I get tired of staying busy and and don't want to face the other tasks it would be smart to do. Even the kind of activities that could fill the time just seem like they would be junk food now. I would really like the pleasure of eating even when I am still not hungry but also would prefer to wait. I really don't like this tug, but I guess it's like parts of a job I don't like.

This is a problem that I had when I first tried intuitive eating way back in the early 80's. I got tired of waiting to get hungry! In fact, I know that some of my eating problems are actually problems with life in general. And I feel I have put tremendous effort into trying to fix that side of things but it is way more complicated and difficult than waiting to eat and learning to enjoy better quality food! I remember the title of a book for those with compulsive eating disorders, which is how I thought of myself: Life is Hard, Food is Easy. That's a little simplistic, but it often fits me.

I woke up hungry today and it hasn't gone away. Dang! I've been at this for weeks and thought it would have kicked in by now to be burning my fats in the morning, like yesterday. Oh, well, less than an hour before I can eat, though I am considering making something in the Instantpot and might wait for it, after my whining!

The obsession continues. I wish I could become obsessed about some other things!

Edited by: OOLALA53 at: 4/24/2020 (12:22)
Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


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WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
4/24/20 8:52 A

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I slept last night! Solidly, all night! I feel better, and I am already back on track!

WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


 Pounds lost: 11.4 
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WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
4/23/20 8:36 P

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I am operating on a severe sleep deficit, and that never helps me stay on track. Rough evening, rough night, been up since 2am.... struggling today, but it happens when I get this upset and this off track with the basics like sleep....

I hope to get a good night's sleep tonight and get back on track tomorrow.

Sounds like you are really listening to your body, even when you're extra hungry! I always try and remind myself that I won't starve in the next x number of hours, or overnight. Sometimes it helps. LOL

WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


 Pounds lost: 11.4 
0
32.5
65
97.5
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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
4/22/20 6:25 P

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I used to use No S pretty religiously and still think it should be a first line of defense against the onslaught of food. Even Fung says that. But appetite changes, aging, concerns about maintaining mental clarity, et al led me a few years ago to start experimenting with IF.

I did use No S for the first couple of months this year because my habits had been so erratic/faulty in the months before, but I was ready to try something different because my meals had to be quite precise for me to dependably get hungry for the next meal, which I prefer. However, even when I am eating in such a short window, I am still really hungry for only one meal a day. But I am not willing to eat just once a day, unless burning ketones starts happening more strongly to weaken my appetite. I'm not hungry but I still want to eat!

Monday morning, I felt no hunger at the time I set to open my window these days, so I held out until afternoon (had online webinars to distract me.) But yesterday and today, I felt hungry almost from the moment I woke up, which can be a long time before eating time! I held out. I haven't intended to eat a bit low in calories, but I have. Could that be why I'm so hungry? Doesn't quite make sense; theoretically, if I'm in deficit, and have been doing this awhile so should have depleted my glycogen stores, my body should be able to get the fat fires burning and decrease appetite. But bodies can be unpredictable! And I actually prefer SOME time being hungry before a meal. In any case, made it today and see no reason I won't be able to keep to my window today. I'm even getting my liquid drinking in. I have never been very compliant regarding water drinking (seeing too many people keeping their water goals and never losing a pound), but I want to see now if it will make an effect on my skin, which relatively recently seemed to jump a couple of levels in dryness. But I am counting two cups of coffee and a lot of tea in the 2-liter quota.

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
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WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
4/22/20 8:49 A

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Sounds like a lovely dinner!

I see you follow the No S guidelines.... I found that they were the Golden Rules for a lot of eating plans, like the Leptin Resistance Diet, Insulin resistance diets, etc. So I've stuck pretty close to them for a very long time. when I start with the snacking, I gain weight faster than you can blink your eyes!

I'm really glad to have found this safe haven, again. I was in this team years ago in one of my previous SP attempts at making connections and finding support and encouragement. IF was sort of "new" then in this country, and speaking of it anywhere else on SP garnered a lot of criticism and negative comments. All those "experts" who said it was wrong....

Anyway, happy to be here again and to find it still with an ember even if not yet a full flame!

I'm back on track with my plan and just knowing it's making a difference and feeling the difference in my body, especially in the evenings and throughout the night is fantastic. It always gives me pause as to why I try other things when this has always worked for me.... I think I let the naysayers and "experts" and significant people in my life get to my head.

This morning I lead my Zoom group, focusing on the positive and fun aspects of fat loss. I'm grateful a few more people are open to virtual meetings since I'm homebound now. I just hope that doesn't stop when restrictions are lifted! But it's one day at a time! Not to worry now!

I hope you have a terrific day ahead of you!

WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


 Pounds lost: 11.4 
0
32.5
65
97.5
130
OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
4/21/20 11:23 P

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I'm glad you found us/me! There are just a few of us here, but for now, that is probably a good thing. I think I said there is a huge group on Facebook, but it is overwhelming to me.

I'm glad to hear you have some freer days; you don't have to defend them to me. From what I've read, losing with fasting has less of a depressing effect on metabolism than if you were eating the lower calories spread out and not getting ketones going, and eating more food will actually temporarily boost the metabolism.

I always think it's funny, too, when a nutritionist says people won't get enough of the right nutrients if they cut way back. I think it's possible a lot of us won't get all that might be better to get from food, but Lordy, does she think people are getting those nutrients from overeating the stuff they do eat? From the bread, chips, sweets, etc. that apparently are the major source of calories in the American diet?

I pretty much gave up snacking- on weekdays, anyway- ten years ago-, but to this day, I still love reveling in memories of the food I had for dinner and how sated my body is all evening. Had a delicious Indian entree and a favorite dressing on veggies, etc. Comfortably full!



Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
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WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
4/21/20 10:03 A

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Hi Oolala!

I'm not certain if your replies were to me, but I am going to answer. emoticon

There are very few iterations of IF I haven't tried, researched, or read about. It's an interesting history, but I won't digress here.

Low carb and keto do NOT work well with me at all. I've tried so many times, with all the promises held out by research. But at the end of the day if I am drastically ill by eating that way, it doesn't matter what the research says. I can't digest fat, not even with a digestive enzyme supplement, and I need a few healthy carbs to keep my serotonin levels up. So the times I have tried combining low carb or keto with IF have just been disastrous for me.

Sadly, I gave it one more go about 10 days ago, and by this past weekend I was so sick... So no more of that!

And the silliest part of all of that is that at the end of March I had started following a new to me plan by Dr. Mosley (very well-known in the UK), which was working fabulously and I felt very good on it. So why did I let myself fall for the low carb/keto hype? emoticon

I am glad that low carb and keto works so well for so many, but it is not true that those ways of eating work for everyone or are miraculous for all, right?

Anyway, sorry I'm rambling.

I like having one main chat thread! SP can be a bit scattered and hard to find real conversations, so one main chat thread works GREAT for me!

I fasted a lot throughout high school and college, just the plain old water fasts, mostly for spiritual reasons. Of course back then they weren't hard to do. I was young. But I've been a health fanatic for long time, because I had "mystery diseases" my doctors laughed at me about and told me they would prescribe me a valium, because there was nothing wrong with me and it was all in my head. So I had to be my own doctor. That's when I began researching health like a fiend, looking for anything that might help.

Decades later, they named those "mystery" diseases (the ones the doctors said I didn't have) PCOS, fibromyalgia, and insulin resistance. By then, 40 years had passed and I had gained a lot of weight and those issues combined with severe spinal and joint degenerative arthritis I've had since I was 23 plus sports injuries and car accidents had done a lot of undoable damage.

Yeesh, I'm sorry I keep digressing.

Anyway, about 4 or 5 years ago I started re-reading about IF, and experimenting with the various plans: QOD diet, UDDDD, etc etc, and finally came across Dr. Michael Mosely's then-new book, The Fast Diet 5:2. While doing 5:2 doesn't work for me (maintains but doesn't help me lose weight, and I found it more challenging than a consistent plan every day). But I knew I was onto something.

That was when I discovered that my body very naturally wants to follow a 16:8 daily plan, sometimes as long as 18:6. I don't like breakfast. Never have. So it's easy for me to skip. And the longer I can stretch that beyond 12 or 14 hours, the better it helps manage my daily pain.

But I had little support to stay on the plan. When people find out, they freak out--you're not eating enough! You'll go into starvation mode! yadda yadda. Then when significant stress hit, all I wanted to do was eat my way through. That significant stress has been chronic and ongoing for 2 years.

Then in mid-March, I discovered that Dr. Michael Mosely has a new book out, the Fast 800. Basically, it's using a 16:8 or more fasting window (whatever is attainable and sustainable for a person) combined with an eating plan of about 800 calories from the healthy Mediterranean way of eating. Does that ever work like a charm for me! He of course says to only stay at the 800 calories for two weeks, then switch to doing it 5:2, but that doesn't work for me, and I am so large that it's going to take a long time to get down to a reasonable weight. It's more unhealthy for me to stay at this weight than to get it off a little bit faster.

I do admit to tweaking the Fast 800 plan a bit to make it comfortable and doable for me. I drink two large mugs of coffee with nothing but a splash of half and half every morning. But I don't eat food until around noon. I let my calories go as high as 900 to 1000 per day, and don't confine myself to a strict 800. I focus on the healthy Mediterranean whole foods plan, but I have not said no never to any food at all, not even sugar. Having sugar in tiny bits as a very small treat, as long as it works into the 800-1000 calories per day and the rest of what I've eaten is healthy, keeps it sustainable for the long term.

I've found that the cravings are gone, my brain is working well, and the weight is dropping. And then once every ten days, on the 10th, the 20th, and 30th of every month, I will have an "up" day, an anything goes day. (This is to keep my metabolism from tanking, which the research shows is important.)

My first week of doing this, March 22nd through March 29th, I lost 12lbs. Then, I decided to experiment. Why I did this, I do not know. (Well, the allure of even faster weight loss...oy!) But it pulled me off plan, and I gained about 4 lbs, and just struggled with the whole gaining and losing the same 4 lbs. for three weeks before finally getting a clue. I had something that worked and it didn't need messing with.

A few days ago I finally got my head back in the game, said buh-bye forever to low carb and keto for me, and now I'm back on the happy bus of Fast 800 my way. This morning the scale is back down to the lowest point I hit at the end of March.

I'm not going to focus on the three weeks of wasted efforts and feeling awful, but on discovering something that really works for me and feels easy to implement.

The reason I came back to SP (been on here many times before as early as 2007) was to see if I could find even just one other person with whom to connect. As I said, people don't understand the word "fast" and freak out. They really think someone as large as me will starve in a couple of days! emoticon And that this will "ruin my metabolism" AS IF if hasn't already been ruined by 6 decades of being obese and my various health issues! I left SP several times over this same thing. You'd think on Spark it would be easier to find a judgement free zone, LOL.

So it's nice to have just one place where I can freely talk about Fast 800 and not get shamed.

WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
4/21/20 12:12 A

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I'll add that for the heck of it, I tracked my calories. I sometimes do it for Spark points or to see where my protein is. (Keeping it under 52 grams a day.) They came to around 770. I guess ketones are being burned, suppressing my appetite. I don't know if you read about the Up Day Down Day diet, but I'm pretty sure he said that a maintenance down day can be about 50% of your regular calories. I don't usually hit that few, but it happened pretty naturally today. I'm not actually willing to make that a habit on purpose because I'm pretty sure I'm maintaining without it and I am trying not to layer too many strategies. I eat a pretty unprocessed diet, though I know that isn't considered essential on many fasting programs; I think that does some of the work of purposeful calorie reduction, since the body doesn't use as many calories from unprocessed foods. I don't claim its hundreds of calories a day, but over time, it makes a difference and I think there are other benefits, but that is a separate issue from fasting, which can have great benefits no matter what you eat. Don' want to deflate anybody! It's your choice what's on your plate.

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
4/20/20 11:10 P

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To that end, I hope it's okay if I suggest that we keep most of our communication here on this thread for awhile. On other teams, I've seen attention get diverted off when members start a lot of new topic threads instead of in just bringing the idea up a central place until that central place gets so "full" that it could use some splitting off. (Not all members get alerts to new threads, and the thread would often fizzle out from lack of interest.) Aack, I've probably turned you off with my preferences right away!

I was about to abandon this team when a notice came that it needed a new team leader. I really wanted a place on Spark to convene fasters in general. I myself am juggling so many influences that it keeps me from feeling like I belong in the few other fasting teams because they are often so influenced by only one or two authors or combine it with low carb, which is not my bias. Also, fasting is not how I lost my weight, and I've had only intermittent success with keeping to any consistent fasting schedule! But I am very interested in fasting for longevity, especially cognitive longevity. And to some degree, to see if it can make a difference in my skin texture/aging. I don't think I'm the best choice for leader except that no one else took it on!

I know I said I suggest keeping most discussion to a main chat thread, but I also envision that if members want more support for some specific styles of fasting, that would be a good reason for targeted threads. Hopefully, those would arise for people who had tried out an IF style, possibly discussing the experiments on the main chat thread, and knew they were pretty committed and would stick with the thread for awhile.

Also, I admit I'm terrible with coming up with challenges and such. I myself have found competitions and such to backfire or just be a stopgap measure, so I'm reluctant to participate, but others like them. Actually, I think others can propose such challenges on new threads any time.

Just to let you know where I am now, I am presently just trying to make 16:8 fasting/eating windows a consistent habit, though I have some days of 18:6. I started just about the time of lockdown and been in compliance with hours most days. I am only now feeling like I might be having some good hours of burning ketones, which others say make it all a lot easier. I don't yet find it easy, but my curiosity is spurring me on. I actually tried different protocols for the last few years, with negative results. But something about a new year and a new decade brought together the forces of motivation. At this time, I don't plan to have a consistent eating window fewer than 6 hours, though some days might work out that way as I get better at filling my time during fasting. I'm very aware of suggestions to get busy, etc. but being able to do that has actually been a chronic issue for me and more challenging than overeating.

Then again, though these are my biases, I won't stop anyone from doing things differently! What do you think about it all?



Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
4/20/20 5:41 P

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It's not very active, but I hope to have a small, supportive group at least. More later.

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


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WINNINGOURWEIGH's Photo WINNINGOURWEIGH Posts: 76
4/20/20 4:23 P

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Ooops! I couldn't find the April chat! LOL

Now I did! Yay!

Looking forward to connect!

WOW! ...finding my weigh towards Winning Our Weigh!
Restart June 1st; chose to follow WW old PointsPlus plan
Using the awesome FREE app, iTrackBites
Also IF 12-15 hours per day
Homebound, disabled, mobility challenged, but not giving up!


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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
4/18/20 1:46 A

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Marie, I actually do know of a longevity researcher who has influenced me in other ways who discourages anything more than 12 hours fasting in senior citizens, but I'm experimenting with it anyway. He has written articles with another longevity expert who recommends a long overnight fast, but not a lot more than that. Neither of them promote it as a weight loss tool, interestingly, and it's not why I'm doing it.

I myself don't consider it particularly easy, and honestly, if I were truly hungry more times a day, I would not do it, but since I have lost a lot of my true hunger drive, I use it. I still have a lot of DESIRE to eat when I'm not actually hungry, which leads me to believe it's a combination of boredom and my body not truly effectively tapping into its fat stores. So many people claim when they get fat adapted, they lose many food thoughts. I'd like to see that happen. I've had about a month of about 85% compliance of a minimum of 16 hours overnight and I still wake up every day wishing I could have a nosh and my coffee with cream and stevia even though I'm not one bit hungry. But I want some of the other benefits besides weight loss, so I'm staying with it for a few more months at least.

Brad Pilon's was the first fasting book I looked at. I have rarely gone 24 hours, but I did get convinced that it was not a crazy thing to do. And I do believe shorter eating windows is a smarter way to reduce eating than using calorie limits alone. I would rather be fat than count calories the rest of my life, unless there is a health reason to do so. And I'm not fat now. I do sometimes track calories, but not for weight loss.

I've read a lot more books on it now, but I'd like to stop obsessing and just do it!

I'm glad you're here! And I would say 21 hours is a definite win.

Are you aiming to do a couple of 24-hour fasts a week, as Pilon recommends? What is your plan for the other days?

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
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CMBMARIE's Photo CMBMARIE Posts: 262
4/17/20 11:26 A

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Good morning!
Here in Michigan, we have 4 inches of heavy wet snow making the entire farm look like a Curry & Ives Christmas painting. LOL It is beautiful. Tomorrow we are supposed to be in the 50s with sunshine. Thank heavens I live on high ground!
I am 19 hours into an accidental 24 hour fast. I ate breakfast early yesterday and did not get around to "lunch" until 4 in the afternoon. I ate a good lunch, healthy choices, and full portions. I didn't overeat, and I didn't skimp. My husband made himself a big salad around 9:30pm and it occurred to me that I had not eaten anything since 4:30. Still I wasn't hungry and went on with my evening. When I went to bed around midnight, I had a passing fancy of eating something before I went up. Realizing that eating right before bed would be pretty stupid, I just went to bed. So, here I am 11:30 in the morning the next day thinking, "Mmmm, you have gone 19 hours with no food, so why not the full 24?" I have done two 24 hour fasts and know full well that these last few hours for me are just mind games/gymnastics. I am not doing any heavy work or exercise. I will let you know how it works out. Have a great day!
12:02 AM 4/18
Well, I made it to 1:30 with out eating, so that was 21 hours. I started getting a little bit of a headache. I don't know if it was from not eating or something else as I did not have this before. I decided not to push it. I still take it as a win. All of the benefits were still there. Day by day. Good night.

Edited by: CMBMARIE at: 4/18/2020 (00:05)
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4/17/20 11:15 A

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Welcome to our group, Rainbow. Have your read Eat, Stop, Eat yet? The author explains things so well, so that it is easy to understand the concept of fasting and why it is a natural way of eating for humans. I tend to drift off and nap when reading, so I purchased the audio book and listened to it while following along in the book. LOL That is how I got through Shakespeare in college a 100 years ago.

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RAINBOW_RAIN's Photo RAINBOW_RAIN Posts: 164
4/15/20 3:20 A

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Hi Guys, i am also new to fasting and is currently exploring how it works

Always have your stuff when you need it with @Dropbox. Sign up for free! http://db.tt/xAJpJZjF db.tt/GZJS55WA


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CMBMARIE's Photo CMBMARIE Posts: 262
4/14/20 11:15 A

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Hi,
For most of my adult life, I have been doing IF and didn't realize it or even know that it was a thing. When I wake up, I am NEVER hungry. This was always an issue in high school because my parents were from the "breakfast is the most important meal of the day" club. I would usually wind up at school barely hanging on to my morning meal. I stop eating around 6ish in the evening and am usually not the least bit interested eating until 10am to noon the next day. Sometimes, I am hungry earlier but not often.
I have read Eat Stop Eat and agree with the principles whole-heartedly. At 71, I was not sure that I should be doing this, so I checked several sources on geriatric fasting emoticon Everything I read indicates that IF is fine for healthy elders. I have done two 24 hour fasts finishing my supper on one night by 6 and eating my next meal after 6 the next night. Eighteen hours is not too difficult for me since I seem synced to that schedule. The next 6 hours is pretty much a mind game. I kept telling myself that hunger comes and goes, so that when I did get hungry in those last 6 hours, I could stick it out getting busy with something to do. I did not do any heavy work on those days; although, I did still walk the dog for 2 miles. We just ambled along and took our time.
With this whole Covid-19 debacle, I have been off the rails. We quarantined since March 15th. I am finally accepting this as the new normal. I need to take care of me in more ways than isolation. So, here I am. I hope all of you are well and in good spirits. If this disease as taken friends or family from you, please accept my sincere condolences. Take care.
Cynthia

 current weight: 188.7 
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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
4/11/20 7:38 P

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Sticking with it. Some days are pretty easy, certainly as easy if not easier than early complicated diets I did back in the day. Actually, some people would think my diet is complicated now, but it's just the way things have evolved as health takes on a bigger role each year as I age, especially memory health!

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
4/10/20 2:28 P

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Keeping with an 8- or 6- hr window. We are having a late rainy season and boy do I miss my doctored coffee in the mornings but don't want to end eating any earlier (consistently) on purpose, so I wait. I did stop around 4 one day, but it was not good, I don't think, because it was angst eating. Wasn't upset about anything in particular, but just had those ansty feelings. Usually, I think it's a very bad idea to reinforce those with food, but I did it. Over now. Sometimes I go another hour or even two in the morning, usually because I just don't feel hungry. But that tends to push brunch and dinner awfully close. Yet I don't want to push it by just skipping dinner if I'm not very hungry and then end up eating later because I actually do get hungry. Trying to sleep while actively hungry just seems like more effort than I'm looking for from fasting. I just would like to feel what it's like for my body to get a flow of ketones for a few hours a day. If it's working right, I shouldn't be very hungry in the morning, but today I sure was. I ate a little more modestly yesterday, finally not feeling like I had the need/right to pick at food between my meals.. I would have thought the body would get to ketones even faster. Oh, well. It's only been a few weeks since I have done it more consistently. Going to suspend judgement for another three weeks.

Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


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OOLALA53's Photo OOLALA53 Posts: 17,257
4/8/20 12:21 P

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I think I had a rebellion day last week but don't usually track ( one of the reasons I am attracted to fasting), so I am not sure when. Shooting for and making it most days to an 8- hour eating window; sometimes 6 hours. Sorry I cannot be more inspiring with weight loss; not doing this for weight loss and will not weigh again until summer solstice. But I know I had lost since the beginning of the year for other reasons and it feels like that has been maintained. (fit of pants)

Edited by: OOLALA53 at: 4/10/2020 (14:02)
Seven years of maintaining a 20% weightloss and counting.
*To seek happiness, identifying the Self with the body, is like trying to cross a river on the back of a crocodile." Ramana Maharshi
*The No S Diet saved me from my emotional eating defeats.
8 years and counting! nosdiet.com/
*Get to the next meal hungry!
www.sparkpeople.com/myspark/groups_i
ndividual.asp?gid=1323


3,851 Days since:  I began the NO S lifestyle
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